Thoughts on the Game8 JP Tier List 8/28/15


Changes from 8/13: Yomi added to S, Neptune Dragon added to A+, Amaterasu added to A, Sonia Gran removed
S 2253 - 破壊神, Shiva Dragon2013 - Awoken Anubis2325 - Awoken Yomi2012 - Awoken Ra2011 - Awoken Bastet1847 - 黒天の幻龍王・Zaerog∞1955 - Awoken Lakshmi
A+ 1954 - Awoken Shiva1747 - Sparkling Goddess of Secrets, Kali1937 - 最強戦士・超ベジット1901 - 最強装備, Juggler2230 - 気狂いピエロ, Kite2030 - Cloud & ハーディ=デイトナ2255 - 海王神, Neptune Dragon2226 - 制約と誓約, Gon Freecss1949 - Lightning Black Dragonbound, Typhon1951 - Tome-Creating White Phantom Demon, Ilm
A 2324 - Awoken Amaterasu Ohkami1947 - Lightning Red Dragonbound, Gadius1736 - Wailing Bleak Night Goddess, Pandora2292 - 冥夜の令嬢, Pandora1953 - Enraged Black Phantom Demon, Zuoh1664 - God of Dark Riches, Osiris1674 - Norn of the Future, Skuld2227 - 神速, Killua Zoldyck1645 - Marvelous Red Dragon Caller, Sonia1371 - Crazed King of Purgatory, Beelzebub1666 - Sacred Life Goddess, Hathor2009 - Awoken Horus2080 - 知徳の麗女神, Sarasvati


Changes from 8/13: Artemis added to A+
S 2078 - 劫火の威女神, Kali1747 - Sparkling Goddess of Secrets, Kali1743 - Restrained Dragon Hero, Liu Bei2180 - 平定の黄泉神, Izanami859 - ドスバギィ&バギィネコ1738 - 覇征の龍武王, Cao Cao
A+ 1726 - Awoken Hinokagutsuchi2290 - 雪白の美姫, Valkyrie Claire1785 - warrior rose, graceful valkyrie2010 - Awoken Isis1557 - Dancing Flame, Amaterasu Ohkami1561 - 超サイヤ人第三段階・トランクス1926 - Heaven-Shaking Thunderdragon, Indra2148 - 早天の日龍喚士, Kanna2235 - 復仇の戦軍神, Ares2236 - 還魂の商業神, Hermes2237 - 月華の狩猟神, Artemis2292 - 冥夜の令嬢, Pandora1733 - Blue Chain Starsea Goddess, Andromeda1736 - Wailing Bleak Night Goddess, Pandora2289 - 楽園の時女神, Urd1670 - Norn of the Past, Urd1674 - Norn of the Future, Skuld1672 - Norn of the Present, Verdandi
A 2076 - Awoken Haku1947 - Lightning Red Dragonbound, Gadius1953 - Enraged Black Phantom Demon, Zuoh2146 - 金風の碧龍喚士, Kaede1734 - Green Star Vanquishing Deity, Perseus2081 - Divine Creator of Order, Vishnu2075 - Awoken Meimei2238 - 渾天の光明神, Apollo2269 - 克明の諜報神, Ishida Mitsunari2273 - 深慮の謀略神, Akechi Mitsuhide1373 - Genius Sleeping Dragon, Zhuge Liang2094 - Phoenix Rider Valen1887 - 幸七羽毛・ヘッドロココ1741 - Soaring Dragon General, Sun Quan

The Game8 list.

It looks like dark has regained it’s top position in the game. Surprisingly, Juggler only plays a secondary role in that revitalization. I guess that’s how far we’ve come in only half a year.

Dark Reclaims Its Throne

2325 - Awoken Yomi
It’s not much surprise that Awoken Yomi was added as an S rank lead. Orb enhances have slowly been gaining the respect they deserve and stacking them with TPAs can result in huge damage bonuses. With Yomi’s release, I believe dark has firmly reclaimed it’s position as the top element in the game. With other elite leaders like Infinirog and Anubis in addition to an ever-increasing quality sub pool — Satsuki, Awoken Haku and Summer Claire to name only a few — dark’s recent surge is no surprise. Not to mention its MP Shop dragon hasn’t even been released yet…

Awoken Amaterasu

2324 - Awoken Amaterasu Ohkami
There’s definitely something to be said about a relatively easy to activate 4x ATK bonus, but I’m still surprised that Amaterasu made the leader list. The auto heal is a nice bonus — almost 18k HP with dual Amaterasu leaders — but it’s not like healer teams were in desperate need of additional healing. One thing Amaterasu does provide is decent HP thanks to her physical type, but outside Supergirl there aren’t any other quality physical-healers to help stack much needed HP. Maybe pairing her with a leader with an HP bonus like Sandalphon is a good idea. Amaterasu also has Iria and the recent Mini Valk uevo going for her, but I’m not sure that’s enough to warrant her inclusion. I don’t have any qualms with her being on the list, I’m just surprised.

The MP Shop and Neptune Dragon

2255 - 海王神, Neptune Dragon
I have a general distaste for the MP Shop dragons and Neptune Dragon is no exception. Sure, they’re powerful, but something about how they’re acquired and the type of teams they promote is off-putting for some reason. I generally enjoying chasing the power creep FotM, but I’m not particularly interested in making teams for them. Maybe them being ugly as sin has something to do with it.

I say this now, but just wait for me to backpedal once the dark dragon is revealed.

Goodbye, Grandma

1760 - Dawning Dragon Caller, Sonia Gran
Your time in the spotlight was short, especially on NA where Awoken Ra was introduced about a month later. Here’s to more descended drops being relevant leaders.

No DMeta?

1644 - Arbiter of Judgement, Metatron
I don’t think anyone likes HP-conditional leads and maybe she’s not on the level of Gon-san, but with her new HP boost DMeta seems pretty damn strong now.

Wood Rows Are a Thing Again?

2237 - 月華の狩猟神, Artemis
I’m also surprised Artemis was added at A+. While I think there’s definite potential in wood rows, I felt that Odin Dragon being a complete dud would’ve tempered expectations. Without a MP dragon row team, I didn’t think she was on the level of Ares and Hermes. I mean, Ishida Mitsunari and Perseus are nice, but not on the level of Shiva Dragon, Neptune Dragon or Awoken Lakshmi. Then I remembered JP has Gon-san. Sigh. It all makes sense now.

Did I miss something? Please leave a comment and let me know!

9 thoughts on “Thoughts on the Game8 JP Tier List 8/28/15

  1. “I have a general distaste for the MP Shop dragons and Neptune Dragon is no exception. Sure, they’re powerful, but something about how they’re acquired and the type of teams they promote is off-putting for some reason.”

    I agree that they’re a bit excesive and pander to the whales, but MP cards are now easily farmable in the ranking dungeons, and with each one being worth 500 instead of the usual 5 points for farmables, sarming MP is now feasible. In addition to the top 30% of scorers getting a card worth 10K MP, if you run this a lot you could feasibly get 20K+ points per event. Which is still going to take some time, but with natural stamina you can run it 35+ times a week. (I wouldn’t say it’s worth stoning unless the drop rate is crazy good though, 5 stones is a guaranteed 3,000 MP, so you would need to get more than 1.3 drops per stone for it to be worth it, 2 if you’re planning on only rolling golds :P)

    As for Neptune dragon specifically, I wouldn’t put him in the same category as Shiva dragon. Shivagon is unconditional whereas nepgon is very conditional. 11 orbs for a 6x multiplier is very powerful, I’ve seen a half dozen+ clears of extreme arena so far, but very orb hungry. It works nicely in the 7×6 boards but has some serious trouble without orb changers. (I’m actually somewhat surprised he’s not S tier, Assuming an ideal team I’d say he’s at least as good as Shivagon… His active actually DOES something, he has a higher multiplier, 4 freaking rows… IDK. He’s better than Lakshmi, and that’s coming from someone who mains Lakshmi, and wrecks face with her.)

    So yeah, I rambled. TLDR: The MP shop in itself is a broken system, which is alleviated slightly by the implementation of the cards that sell for higher MP. It’s still broken, but it’s a little more balanced now. Still needs work though. As for Neptune Dragon, The team he promotes is just a buffed hero team, so I don’t know what you mean there… 😛


    • Also, Awoken Yomi HYPE!!! Like, seriously excited at how good s/he is now! Day 1 hypermax! Well, max at least. We’ll see about the plusses later… Finally someone worthy of my badpys!


    • I think you misinterpreted the intent of the words you quoted or I didn’t word it clear enough. One of the most important things in PAD for me are the highs and lows of building teams. Sometimes the REM giveth, sometimes it taketh away. Sometimes you roll garbage, but sometimes it’s buffed to elite levels. No matter your team makeup or how much real money you did or didn’t spend, you had to go through those experiences to put your team together.

      The MP Shop circumvents that entirely, at least for leaders. It’d be fine if it was a simple outlet to recoup value from unfavorable RNG, but (most) of the MP dragons we’ve seen so far are extremely powerful and are as good if not better than most of the best leaders in the game. If you buy them it means you’re not just using MP as a consolation prize, but using a backdoor to directly advance in the game. I feel the resulting teams lack some of the love other teams might otherwise have; that’s what I mean by the type of teams they promote.

      I don’t have any problems with anyone using the MP Shop to their advantage if that’s rewarding for them, it’s just don’t think it will be for me. However I can’t pass final judgment until we get it on NA.


      • (Gonna open this reply letting you know that I wasn’t trying to be offensive in my first post, nor am I here. Don’t want to unintentionally tick people off.)

        Not sure if I misinterpreted or the wording was confusing, but either way, I interpreted “the type of teams they promote is off-putting for some reason.” to mean that the teams themselves were bad, like how Shivagon is unconditional and OP. I was saying that Nepgon is very different in terms of playstyle, where you actually have to work for his multiplier. Now that you’ve elaborated I see better where you were coming from.

        I think I see exactly where our opinions diverge: You’re looking at leads with the trials and tribulations of building teams with farmable options at first, then slowly rolling the right subs for the team. I’m looking at these guys as a “you only buy them if you already have an ideal team lined up.” Not sure how accurate that is, but based on: “you had to go through those experiences to put your team together.” I’m going to assume that’s where you’re coming from.

        And I do get what you’re saying, I did the exact thing with my Horus team in the early-mid game, level some subs that were eventually swapped out, get lucky and unlucky at various godfests… I get it. But at the same time, my horus team was bad. Still is. I used to be a pretty big spender, so I have a LOT of cards in my box. So one day, I looked at it and saw that I had a perfect Pandora team just sitting there. So I built the team, no leveling and swapping, just building the exact team I already had lined up. And suddenly I started winning! Clearing dungeons where Horus died floor 1 (I’m not the best at playing Horus either…), taking on some challenge dungeons and not losing! But then I hit a roadblock. I couldn’t clear C8 and above. Too hard. So I took to the internet where I read somewhere that A Lakshmi was one of the best leaders for clearing C 10 (This was pre-A Egyptians). So I looked at my box and started theorycrating, and I wrote a guide, and built the team that I had theorycrafted. (Fun fact, I used a lot of info on your blog as the framework of the guide! I credited you and gave a link as well, so I hope we’re cool…) And I think that’s why I look at these guys and see them as good leaders that you can buy if you have the right lineup, and you see them as soulless cards with bad art that you don’t work towards building, you work towards buying. (Or I’m completely wrong. *Shrugs* That’s my best guess at least.)

        “If you buy them it means you’re not just using MP as a consolation prize, but using a backdoor to directly advance in the game. ”

        I’m… not sure if I agree. On the surface that seems true, but at the same time, that only applies to people who drop several hundred dollars, and trade it all for MP. Are there people where that applies? Of course, but at that point is it really a back door? Odds are you don’t roll an entire perfect team before you hit 300K MP (OK, maybe I’m exaggerating a little bit, but still). The S tier leaders are VERY limited in what subs are good on them. I mean, in a void you can run Ra with anything, but in reality the people who use Ra to clear C10 or Extreme area are (Generally/ideally) running 2 L kalis and a D kali. Not a single S tier card is any good (for endgame content) without 2 or 3 ideal subs, and you REALLY want to have all 4 subs be ideal. Before you end up with the exact 5 cards to make a good team, you’ll end up with a lot of garbage. Garbage you can sell for MP. And if that happens all at once or over a lifetime, you’ll still be selling crappy cards and fifth+ dupes of even the good cards. At that point it isn’t really a backdoor at all, it could actually take much more tie and effort to get than an actual REM team. Or not. IDK, you could foll five D Kalis in a row, or you could never roll one. The REM is a cruel mistress…

        At this point my train of thought is derailing. Hopefully my point made it through in there somehow, if not, sorry!

        TLDR: I misunderstood where you were coming from, now that I see what you meant, I can also see where my acceptance of the cards comes from a different mindset than your distaste. I see them as something to work towards if you have a good team in mind, and I think you see them as cashing in your bad luck to become instantly OP by skipping the majority of the team building process. Either way, I eagerly await beach Claire. Because screw the ugly dragons, let’s buy waifus instead!

        Liked by 1 person

        • I think that sums up everything neatly. I’m glad I have a better perspective of your point of view now, too, and I see the value in it.

          I want to add that I didn’t find you offensive or anything at all and I apologize if you got that impression from my reply. It’s always difficult to converse and argue through just text as tone is difficult to infer. I just want to assure you that your posts are always welcome. It’s always good to see things from a different perspective.


  2. I never really cared about the red or blue MP dragons because they just looked like very boring and overpowered farming leads, ie another way for whales to torment themselves, but the new one is just a straight up updated version of l/l ra.

    Makes me worried that they’re actually going to end up balancing the game around these things.


    • I mean, the game has certainly been powercreeping along, the switch from 2/4/2 teams to 1/16/1 teams brought about a major shift in difficulty. And the awoken cards have brought about another shift, this time with challenge dungeons and extreme arena. In my opinion, these guys are a result of extreme arena being too hard for 95% of teams, so they made a “farmable” monster that was strong enough to take it on. Could be wrong though, who knows? Regardless, I don’t think we’ll see another major shift in difficulty until a majority (Or even 30%) of teams can clear extreme area. That seems to be the pattern: hard content, few teams can beat it, new leads released that can more easily beat it, buffs to old cards that can more easily beat it, new harder content. Repeat. We’re somewhere in the middle of the new leads that can beat it, and old cards getting buffed, so we have a while to go IMO. But, then again, who really knows?


  3. I’m sure you’ve considered it before, but I would love it if you put a NA tier list together. I know reasons why you wont: I’ve seen your reddit posts (it’s basically ARa, ABastet, AShiva), we’re largely based off Japan’s minus collabs, and it’s highly controversial/subjective. Also, you are probably limited by your box and havent worked through team building with other teams. Still, I think you and a handful of other people could do a better job of creating a NA list.

    The Japan list is for perfectly hypermaxed teams, which require IAP and often require high amounts of skill or luck (eg. Anubis, or even Bastet 7+ comboing is for an above average player). Perhaps the NA list could have different criteria. For example, size of sub pool or ease of farming through coin dungeons are arguably as important as end-game Kalisseum clearing. My ARa and Bestcat teams run train on all descends, but God knows my verd team is safer and faster running coins. Your Meimei system trivializes the game, but most people don’t even have one AMeimei. The NA list would be different. For example (these are largely my BS guesses) ARa might have a 10/10 for end game, but a 4/10 for farming, 2/10 for sub accessibility. Verd would have a 7 for end game, 10 for farming, and 8 for sub pool. Both get a high rank for different reasons.

    The point isn’t that there should be an end-all ranked-list. It’s that many people want to know how good is the card they just pulled or what to concentrate on next. Of course they can go to the reddit user guides (in fact, you would probably pull your initial ranking data from there), but a list that’s updated every few weeks gives a quick snapshot, which our increasingly ADD society loves.

    Really, I just like top tier commentary and want more (work) from you, haha. I check here almost as much as reddit. And even if you might not know everything, you have thoughtful/well supported comments. The comments about the game8 list are nice, but NA deserves it’s own meta rankings. Of course, people will argue; “osiris is just as good as Parvati = perseus = urd = verd so why is isn’t he the same rank?”, but that’s part of the fun in team building games like this, right?


    • This is a well thought out post and I appreciate the suggestion. That being said, I’m reluctant to write a tier or ranking list for all the reasons you already pointed out. I do think there’s value in having a list specifically for NA, but I think leaving it up to a single person to do it properly is a) a lot of work and b) too narrow a perspective. It’d be cool if we could do something like they do for fantasy sports where a group of analysts each give their own rankings and you can make direct comparisons based on many different points of view. Sadly, that too is a lot of work and I actually think it’s much more difficult to do such a thing for PAD.

      As for putting out something regardless of all the potential negatives and having it be updated every few weeks, there’s definitely value in that too. While I do enjoy engaging with readers in the comments and find it very educational, I’m not sure I’m prepared to handle that. I’ll give some thought to doing it in the future and if there’s a way I can do it to minimize the amount of work I have to do I’ll consider it.


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