Farmable Monster Analysis: Elia & Grisar

1848 - Angel of Secret Destiny, Elia1849 - Psychopomp of Oblivion, GrisarElia and Grisar are a new set of event-based invades, somewhat like the Spirit Jewels. They invade Mythicals and Rushes, but their schedule is more like what the Jewels have for Rushes: which invade you get varies by the hour of the day. They’re REM-quality monsters, but don’t let their farmability fool you into thinking that they’re accessible. They’re extremely expensive to skill up, pricing them well out of range of the average player.

How to Farm and the Invade Schedule

As their worth is directly tied to your ability to skill them up, let’s first start with how to do so. Going by what JP gets, Elia and Grisar’s invade schedule is similar to the Spirit Jewel Rush schedule except it’s in eight hour increments instead of three. Basically the invade schedule starts when the event starts, starting with Elia and swapping to Grisar after eight hours, then rotating between the two for the rest of the event. This guarantees a farming window for the descendeds you wanted to farm the most that particular event. This schedule could possibly change for the NA server, though, and I’ll make sure to update this post if it does.

The Cost of Skill Ups

Elia and Grisar are both obviously powerful, but you need to skill them up before you think about using them; a 22-turn 1:1 orb change isn’t remotely usable, even with a one-turn haste. Currently, the only ways to skill them are through farming dupes and pys. Unfortunately max level uevo dupes can’t be used for guaranteed skill ups since, well, they don’t have uevos yet. Maybe someday.

I wasn’t able to find any concrete invade rates, but I’d assume they’re similar to that of the Spirit Jewels and Latent Tamas. Farming invades is an extremely expensive process, as personally witnessed with my Spirit Jewel farming. The invade rate is likely similar to jewels with about 15% for Mythicals. For the sake of argument, let’s be optimistic and assume a 20% invade rate for Mythicals and skill ups are done under a 2.5x event. This means we’ll need 60 total fodder. We get a drop every 250 stamina. That’s 1,000 stamina per skill up and 15,000 stamina total. Given a well ranked player with 300 stamina, that’s 50 stones worth of stamina. If we go the other way and assume a 10% invade rate, that’s 30,000 stamina and 100 stones. Not cheap at all. Going the Py route is arguably worse since you can’t take advantage of overlapping 10x or 5x +eggs for descended events. Assuming a Py rate of one every 2,000 stamina, that’s still 30,000 stamina.

So, Are They Worth It?

No. Only the most dedicated players will be able to utilize these monsters as they’ll be the only ones that can afford to skill them up. Considering how they’re unusable to the majority, they’re actually a nuisance more than anything. Not only are the invades difficult for the average player to beat, they take the place of a possible Jewel or Latent invade event, two things that are actually useful to everyone.

Despite their inaccessibility, they’re still very strong and it’s worth considering their uses. Their offensive awakenings, skill boost and skill bind resist are well known, valuable qualities at this point, but the resists shouldn’t be underestimated. 10% reduction for light or dark is very relevant in endgame dungeons. While latents provide a similar effect, you won’t have to occupy your precious latent slots to do so. At the very least they’ll be instrumental in surviving some of the biggest hits in the game, particularly preemptives.

Uses for Elia

1848 - Angel of Secret Destiny, Elia
While Elia is quite powerful, her optimal uses are quite limited as many of light’s best leaders require dark orbs to activate. Here are the ones that don’t:

Team Notes
2389 - Awoken Sakuya Sakuya is the most obvious fit as she doesn’t need dark orbs. Her main competition is Mini Valk, but Elia is more valuable for a few reasons. The most obvious is her haste which is the only active effect in the game that’s in the same league as orb changes in terms of raw power. I also strongly believe that breaking hearts is a liability considering how many huge preemptives need to be navigated in today’s endgame. The last and perhaps most important reason is that Elia can combo with an LKali board, but Valk cannot.
2148 - Dawn Sky Sun Dragon Caller, Kanna Elia isn’t an obvious fit here because she isn’t a dragon, but she still qualifies for the god-based ATK bonus of Kanna’s leader skill. As the team leans heavily on Apocalypse’s hearts for survival, it’s important to have an orb changer that doesn’t break them while still being able to set up a two-color board, making Mini Valk a suboptimal choice. Elia’s haste also synergizes well as the entire team has one, allowing you to string together Apoc actives reliably. The downside is that she won’t really be used in the Arena, being replaced by Zeus & Hera in order to deal with the Kalis.
2324 - Awoken Amaterasu Ohkami While Elia qualifies for the team as a healer, Mini Valk is generally a better choice since she has the ability to combo with Da Qiao’s orb change. Amaterasu doesn’t mind losing hearts, either, due to the nature of her leader skill.
2441 - 裁爪の橙龍契士・Saria Elia doesn’t have a place on this team since she doesn’t combo with Saria’s board change to help set up the burst turn.

Sakuya is the only great fit and is really the only leader worth going through the trouble of skilling one up for. However, that’s not even a certainty as the Dark Sakuya team is seen by many of the best players as the the more consistent endgame team, further diminishing Elia’s worth.

1422 - Guardian of the Sacred City, Athena
I wouldn’t consider Elia as a leader for anything outside of farming. She forms a decent leader pair with Athena which is also nice for no-dupe coin dungeons. She’s also not a terrible pair with herself, bringing a respectable 9x ATK and 2.25x RCV. The fundamental problem still remains, though: if you can get an Elia you probably already have a decent farming lead.

Uses for Grisar

1849 - Psychopomp of Oblivion, Grisar
Sadly, Grisar has even fewer uses than Elia. You know you’re in trouble when your best leader is Pandora. Rather than scraping the bottom of the barrel to find mediocre uses for Grisar, here are a few reasons why Grisar doesn’t have a good home:

  • Dark has shifted away from rows. Most of dark’s elite leads are combo-intensive, meaning rows are useless. The one exception could be Yomi Dragon, but Grisar doesn’t qualify as a god and outside 5×4s that team would rather have TPAs, too. DMeta is making a resurgence so he’d be a good fit there, but I’m not sure that team is good enough to warrant the investment. Only time will tell.
  • There are no good devil leads. The days of Beelzebub-RSonia are long since passed. Akechi has potential, but it won’t be fully realized until the Segoku get their uevos. Ditto for Lumiel, although to a lesser degree.
  • He doesn’t combo with any board changes. There isn’t a single dark-main board changer that creates both dark and light orbs. The best off-color options are Meimei and Apocalypse.
  • Two of dark’s best orb changers also change light orbs. Pandora and Persephone, to be precise. There’s a strong possibility of orb fatigue if you use orb changers that change the same orb type.

He definitely has potential, especially if YamaP continues to make good on his promise to push rows, but at this point there’s no reason to commit the resources into skilling him up.

1746 - Chaotic Flying General, Lu Bu
As a leader, he’s pretty much the same as Elia. He pairs well with Lu Bu and himself, but is also limited to farming duty. I’d argue that rows are significantly worse than TPAs for farming, so I’d probably avoid using Grisar as a lead, assuming you can even get one.


It’s a shame that such great, farmable monsters are basically priced out of usability. Even if there was a reasonable way to skill them up, they’d still have very limited uses. To put it frankly: if you even have to think about whether they’re worth investing in, that means they aren’t. Here’s hoping that they become more relevant in the future because it seems like such a waste otherwise.


33 thoughts on “Farmable Monster Analysis: Elia & Grisar

  1. Just curious what is this dark Sakuya team people have been using? I’ve heard about it all over the forums but don’t actually know what it is. Thanks!


    • Reco used a party of Awoken Sakuya/DKali/DIza/Beach Claire/Awoken Tsukuyomi/Awoken Sakuya to clear the Kaliseum before. I thought it was basically a joke because you might as well play Awoken Ra instead if you have to hit all 5 attributes to really deal damage.

      I’ll be trying hard to farm Elia, because she’ll be a critical member in my Awoken Amaterasu team (I don’t have DQ) and not-so-distant Awoken Sakuya team.


    • The dark version of team, as listed in freudianeu’s comment, is seen as the most consistent version of the team for the Arena as it has more time extends and takes advantage of how OP DIza is. It has an advantage over Ra since it doesn’t rely on actives to reach its full multiplier, making it stronger against skill delay. The Sakuya gravities are also key in consistently taking down the Kalis where Ra has to dedicate a sub slot to do so. I’d imagine most people will stick with a light-based Sakuya team, though.


      • Setsu, what do you mean when you say “takes advantage of how OP Diza is?” Isn’t she pretty powerful already on many other teams? Can you elaborate on this :advantage” when using Diza in a sakuya team?


        • I think you’re reading too much into my words. What I meant was that a normal light-based Sakuya team doesn’t have DIza, while the dark-based team does. That alone gives the dark team a huge advantage.


      • On reflection, I can see the advantage of playing a dark based Sakuya team over Awoken Ra. Still, I find it hard to believe it may be more consistent than a light heavy Sakuya team (e.g. Sakuya/LKali/LKali/Elia (or Kanna)/Susano/Sakuya).

        I plan to go Sakuya/LKali/LKali/Elia/Kushinada/Sakuya for my team (like Dacho and @i did in Paprika’s recent video), but I also have the pieces for a dark Sakuya team (except for Beach Claire, but HVamp can take her place). If the latter is that much better, I’m not sure which to focus on.


  2. Yup, aside from A. Sakuya I’ve have yet to see any use for these two. For farming lead it’s even more pointless on JP server because there are no coin dungeons for py farming anymore. Hell, I bet when the Arena hits NA, they will remove those coin dungeons.

    On an unrelated note, the new Starvault (50 stam) is awesome. 5 guarantee plus eggs, no chest drop, no skip. Not sure how good it is compare to just farm Hera Sowilo and Kanegetsu though.

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  3. I have no qualms stoning for jewels/latents/+eggs but this is pushing it.

    I imagine the types of players who plan on using Sakuya seriously will have a hyper Elia ready to go regardless. In the meantime, I’ll root for these two to shine on future teams before I go nuts over skill ups.


  4. I just saw their invade skill sets on PADX… man they are actually pretty tough!

    There’s also that director’s carnival… what are your thoughts on that? It has some amazing Egyptians and Valks so it might be very good in terms of value?


    • I’d like to know the same thing….. I own zero of ANY of the cards featured except Vritra and these cards excluding Chinese and Japanese 1 are some of the best in the game. And considering Venus is featured……… Should I pop all my stones on these? Or just a few? This is perfect. It might not have all the shiny GFEs people want but it sure has the tried-and-true cards that I personally need.


      • This sounds like good value for you then. I’m reluctant to recommend rolling in a carnival out of habit, but this seems like a good chance to grab some good leaders, utility subs or that Venus that you’ve been coveting.


        • I’m just worries about my overall chances of pulling something featured. There’s fewer cards overall increasing the chances of pulling silvers and troll golds…. We’ll see. As eager for players choice as I am, most of the best leads right now such as Yomi and Ra are heavily reliant on specific REM subs I don’t have and likely will never obtain/take forever to do so (Haku, DKali, Satsuki, etc) especially the pesky 6* GFEs that I honestly have no use for given my box (sans Kanna…). Oh the woes of being nonIAP, I have to ration the 60 stones I have saved up and I don’t know how…


    • Feels like a pretty big trap, as carnivals usually are. Egypt 1 and Indian 1 are nice, but of course that’s offset by the Archangels and Greco-Romans. The value is even lower as there’s no GFEs. It’s not a terrible event, but I’d avoid it unless you have multiple hits.

      This is also one of the few chances to get Valks at increased rates (and I guess the Zhuge Liangs, too), but it’s not like they’re that great anymore, especially since they lack critical SBRs. The MP Dragons breathed some new life into them, but they’re in no way necessary for those teams.


  5. I was wondering about the ‘guaranteed skill-up’ thing with these invades. The patch notes mention…

    …ult evo’d cards at lv 99. I was wondering how that applied to cards such as this one where they have no evo of any kind. You’d think that it should work, that their only version is technically their ‘ultimate version’.

    Looking at these cards a few weeks ago I thought that was why they made them require 6million xp to max level instead of 4 million. Anyways no idea if it has been confirmed in JP that guaranteed skill-ups do not work in their case, but if so then making them require 6 million xp as well is just petty on gungho’s part. Giving their active skill 16 levels surely was enough lol


    • If the monster doesn’t have an ultimate evolution as specified in-game, it won’t work. Elia and Grisar don’t have ultimates, so it won’t work, guaranteed. I thought this was pretty clear.


      • As far as I can tell these are the only cards in the game that require 6 million xp and have no evo’d form. All the other ones (Zeus & Hera, Scarlett, Phantom Dragon King, Sonia Grand) all were released with an evo.

        Just thought it was an interesting anomaly in how the cards are configured in relation to what has come before.


        • I don’t know what this has to do with them being/having ultimates or not. Trying to read into how or why GungHo determines certain stats is just going to confuse you more than help.


          • I find free to play game psychology interesting, and gungho arguably do it better than anyone else does. Simply musing about the mechanics behind how these cards are acquired and skilled up(appearing across multiple days in different decends) vs. the more standard way of doing things (giving them their own dungeon).

            They have previously introduced farmable orb changers of some utility (like amberjack) that could be max skilled by most players (and had a reasonable number of skillups to max skill), however the more I think about these two cards the less interested I am in getting one.

            Using your estimated 15,000 stamina to skill up (assuming the standard invade rate), this would cost someone with 200 stamina 75 stones and god help you if you can’t clear the invade 100% of the time…

            I think these two cards are designed exclusively for the top couple of percent of players that are willing to spend 50+ stones and devote the time to run decends 300 times (3 minutes per run will take 15 hours! lol). Everybody else would be better served spending all of those stones on the next godfest. Don’t fall for it people its a trick!


  6. I was pretty stoked for Elia, since I have a Sakuya, but I can’t afford her cost…kinda messed up that the only folks who can afford to get and skill these two don’t need them.


  7. I agree with basically everything you wrote, and add that while I was initially excited to see these guys come to NA, I think I’m actually more annoyed than anything else now, since in addition to the high cost, the invades are not trivial to plan around for non-toptier teams and can easily cause a wipe. Also, if your team can handle one but not the other, or if you only want one, that essentially restricts your playtime to 8 hour windows, which might fall in the middle of the workday. Ugh.

    That being said, I can see one very narrow niche of player for whom Elia might be worth pursuing: a non/light-IAP player who’s managed to roll Kanna and has a decent but not great team — that player a) is likely to be missing multiple key subs, so Elia represents a big upgrade, b) has fewer chances to upgrade via REM, and c) may have a bunch of pys sitting around and nowhere to spend them (e.g. I have 7 flampys but zero fire monsters with awoken forms).

    This might also apply to non/light-IAP players who’ve rolled Sakuya/Amateratsu and already have enough pys to max them, though that’s less likely since a player with enough pys to max both those and Elia, even a non-IAP one, is likely to have been around long enough to have a better developed box.


      • I think they were referring to non-IAP with an excess of Shynpys and how Elia could be a reasonable outlet for them depending on their situation. It’s a narrow case, but is totally legit.


  8. Yeah, I don’t know why people were begging for these two to come to NA, since their invades seem like a real pain in the ass, and realistically how many people are going to skill them up? No thanks. I mean I get that Elia is really pretty, but it’s not like PAD is short on pretty girls.


  9. One thing to consider when calculating the effective cost of maxing elia/grisar is that the event will eventually be simultaneous with 5x descends like in JP, resulting in somewhere around 1500plusses. Still, requiring ~600 runs is absolutely ridiculous.


    • The time before last that she invaded it was a 10x event meaning you’d get 3000 plusses. Those also included coin descends but we don’t seem to have them here (just rushes). I wonder if they’ll pull the alt normals and techs out soon. I haven’t really got into doing them.


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