Quick Thoughts on the JP Stream 9/29/16

Since these posts seem fairly popular, I’ll continue to do them while I have time. All content will be hidden after the break. As with all quick thought posts, there’s minimal editing and I might say wrong/stupid things, so please correct me if that’s the case.

Source: PDX.

  • PAD Cross Tourney – Tsubaki Buffs – Probably the card I wanted to win the least if only because more mediocre LMeta buffs would’ve been quite amusing. It’ll be interesting to see where they take her, though. Since she already has nine awakenings and her active is already quite good, any buffs would likely be for her leader skill, which is where most people would’ve wanted improvements anyways. There’s plenty of ways to speculate on the direction they’ll take, but hopefully it’s more than just an ATK multiplier adjustment.
  • Dungeon Renewals – Zzz. On a kind-of-related-but-not-really note, be aware that JP now has an event where SDRs invade Special Descended Rush (the coin dungeon). This is nowhere as lucrative as the old MHera and MZeus invades, especially since most people that can farm it likely already skilled up most if not all the drops long ago, but depending on the invade rate, this could be a decent way to acquire these rare and valuable latents. I’m not sure if it’ll be better than farming PreDRA Infestation or even farming MP and buying them during a half-price event, but it’s definitely something to pay attention to.
  • Buffs – As promised, there were many. I’ll go over the ones that are interesting to me.
    • Armored Knight and Gemstone Princess Damage Enhances Now Last Two Turns – Did the Gemstone Princesses really need buffs to two-turns?  They were already the damage enhance of choice and now the Norse lost one of their few edges in comparison. The Armored Knight buffs were needed, but it’s still hard to see a situation where they’ll be an optimal choice. I was initially thinking of the MP Dragons and Muse, but even then Carat would still likely be better for all of them except Neptune. I guess they really want to get people to roll for those gala exclusives (jokes on them I already rolled😦 ).
    • Famiel and Lumiel True Damage Now Hits All Enemies – I remember a semi-recent Reddit thread lamenting the lack of more inheritable, high-damage area lasers a la Awoken Ra. This probably wasn’t exactly what they had in mind, but at least there are more options. For many, this makes two fairly useless cards at least have some utility.
    • Legendary Hero Buffs – As someone that just rolled all of these from the Director’s Carnival, I wasn’t expecting buffs anytime soon, but they are of course welcome. It’s pretty disappointing that 10 of the 30 or so buffs were spent on gala-exclusives that really didn’t need them.
    • Awoken Kagutsuchi – He now does a 64k-ish auto-attack when hypered. I don’t really think this changes anything, but as usual, I’ll leave it up to JP to figure out any shenanigans. With the advent of co-op, I’m not really expecting any farming applications from auto-attacks, though. Actually having an ATK multiplier is somewhat interesting, though, making him a potential perseverance killer. However, with the new light and dark Wisdom Kings and even Aoshi having a higher multiplier, I don’t see his leader prospects improving much.
    • Xiu Min and Xin Hua Buffs – This leaves Xiu Min at a 306.25x max ATK multiplier and Xin Hua at 1/225/4 for balanced. Seems pretty strong; I actually redid the calculations a couple times to make sure I had done them correctly. It feels like there’s going to be a lot of competition for the tier lists in the coming update and I’m not really sure who’s going to make it.
  • New Cards – Water LKali and Fire Sakuya – PDX reports these being obtainable from the GungHo Collab Pal Machine. These cards obviously aren’t game changers, but they’re pretty damned nice for “free”. The Sakuya recolor looks amazing and I’ll do my best to get her should she reach NA.
  • Uevos
    • Ishtar – One of the few times GungHo truly exceeded my expectations. Her active works similar to Sanosuke in what is effectively a single-target laser, but can be better, useless or anywhere in between depending on the situation. It’s still a great capability to have access to, especially in wood. Her awakenings are super-strong, giving her the ability to blow out dragons by pairing two TPAs with a dragon killer and her two skill boosts mean she can carry her weight in co-op. No, I don’t expect widespread use or anything, but I’m always thankful that solid farmable options exist so people can fill the holes on their teams until they get something better. At the very least, they’ll be left with a decent utility player for the future.
    • Kanna – I never expected splits for GFEs nor for their main element to change, but Kanna does both. Now, where’s my Satsuki?
      • Sub – Her sub form gets a fourth TPA, putting her above Scheat as far as pure TPA damage. Bind immunity is always welcome as well, putting her in line with her New Year’s form. However, as with the original evo Kanna, I’m skeptical whether a truckload of damage and not much else is enough to make her relevant, especially with the Gemstones making all other damage enhances somewhat irrelevant. Her viability will likely be contingent on how something like uevo Ra Dragon turns out.
      • Leader – A combo-conditional RCV multiplier is interesting and is generally better than an active-reliant one. However, no matter how you slice it, a 2.25/27.56/2.25 for gods and dragons isn’t very impressive. I actually redid the math a few times because I couldn’t believe it was really that low. Buffs incoming? This also likely means that Satsuki will have a light/dark leader form, something that saddens be greatly since I was hoping her uevo would give my JP alt’s predominately dark box some new life. I guess I’ll be waiting for Lumiel and Nephthys ults, or maybe revo Yomi or Haku?
    • Ilm – I recently picked up my second Ilm, in what feels like a year after my first one, and was pretty happy about it. Now I wish I had more again. I’m really, really hoping there’s no OP farming team that requires the full five.
      • Sub – Apparently Ilm is a grill, at least in this form. There really isn’t much to say here. The added awakenings are obviously amazing, but outside farming and maybe ranking dungeons, where will she see play?
      • Leader – So is this one female as well? Or was Ilm always female and I just assumed it was male? Upon further inspection, the original art did also feature a fairly slight waistline. Anyways, Ilm is apparently now a 1/100/6.25 leader. The element match restriction is still there, but the combo requirement barely seems like one since you’re making at least three combos to attack anyways. That’s also Sonia-level RCV, but assuming Ilm isn’t an endgame lead, it could easily go to waste.
  • Revos – Just want to say, those stat boosts… wow! 1,000 weighted stats are no joke. In addition, aside from Kushinadahime, all the cards with over 900 weighted have no sub-element, but these do. The re-addition of god type is quite relevant as well with the MP Dragon uevos on the horizon (assuming they’ll still be god-based).
    • Greco-Romans – Largely unimpressed, especially considering the 16 million EXP it’ll take to max level them again, but I guess the added stats are still worth it. 50% resistances to three of five elements including dark is respectable, but is largely a joke compared to the heart-crosses even if it is a passive bonus. A bump up to 36x ATK could mean they see niche leader play against specific dungeons, much like they did in the past, but for the most part they simply can’t compete with the meta. Perhaps the most unfortunate thing is that they still have the same terrible awakenings. Resisting all elements for 50% would overboard and would be a horrible game design choice, but I feel like that’s the kind of power they’d need to compete with the heart-cross, especially at a 36x ATK multiplier.
      • Minerva – I remember thinking she was an amazing sub when she was first released, being a quick orb changer with so much upside compared to the Ninjas. It’s funny how the tables have turned. Having three, maybe four of your awakenings be useless — with jammer resists being actively bad against something like Ilsix — and no killers to pick up the slack is a huge downside. She does have like 50% more weighted stats than Chiyome, but she’s disappointing nonetheless. However, with Krishna, now revo Shiva and in the future Shiva Dragon, there’s definitely a world where she’ll see play.
      • Neptune – I don’t think Neptune will ever be relevant and the Gemstone buffs only further cement his obscurity.
      • Ceres – If it weren’t for the substantial revo stat boost, I feel like Ceres Ana would still be the automatic choice. I’m a fan of bind recovery awakenings so revo Ceres is appealing in that respect, but it’s hard to deny the damage that her Ana version can bring. I think most will still choose to go with Ana, but the ability to farm Awoken Ceres skill ups, from the PEM in particular, will make her more appealing to those short on Woodpys. I’m still a huge fan of her art, even if I do prefer the original coloring more.
    • Indian 1 – Unlike the Greco-Romans, the Indian 1 changes are pretty impressive. Despite being old, their awokens are still relevant leaders thanks to several rounds of buffs. These revos basically double those multipliers and should go a long ways towards revitalizing their use.
      • Shiva – Now 1/49/4, up from 1/27.56/2.25. Shiva, along with Bastet, always had inferior ATK multipliers compared to their contemporaries, but the fact that you could easily stack main-element matches meant that they always did more damage than the pure multipliers would imply. I actually like him compared to Kaede. Obviously he’s nowhere near her level, but hear me out. Kaede also does more than enough damage at 49x, in large part to her triple TPAs. Shiva only has two TPAs, but his +800 point base ATK advantage helps make up for that. Kaede has an effective 4x RCV with her heart-cross and Shiva also has 4x RCV. Of course, he’s missing the 4x effective HP and his active is much worse, but having two of your three multipliers compare favorably to the best leader in the game has to be worth something. Perhaps a better comparison would’ve been Krishna, but I thought it’d be more compelling to compare him to Kaede :^). I believe he could crack the tier lists again, but it’s so crowded at the top that he might slip through the cracks. Using Game8 as an example, if Krishna is AA, I could easily see Shiva at A.
      • Lakshmi – Now 1/100/4, up from 1/56.25/2.25. In my opinion, if we’re talking about just one, singular awakening, another skill boost is the best she could’ve gotten. All of water’s water+heart orb changers (except Y’shtola) only come with one so this is a great help in having actives ready early in the dungeon. Any offensive awakening would’ve been nice, too, but you can get those from said subs. The light sub-element isn’t great against the various absorb shields, but is a small complaint in the big picture. She should be an easy addition to the JP tier lists.
      • Parvati – Now 1/100/4, up from 1/56.25/2.25. Having shed most of her old problems since her initial release, Parvati is looking well positioned and for the most part should be on the same level as Lakshmi as a lead. The bind recovery awakening might not be the most exciting, but it makes her so much better overall. Being able to clear binds on top of her orb-enhancing, heartmaking active means she can fulfill so many roles just from a single card, as a leader and especially as a sub.
  • MP Dragons – Those evo mats… I guess I slightly regret not farming the Radar Dragons. It’s a tall order for NA, though. Arena 3 is far from trivial and the Radars don’t drop all that frequently from what I gather. It makes me wonder if they’ll make them a one-time dungeon at some point since it’s unlikely we’ll ever get PAD Radar here. In any case, GungHo can ill afford to mess these up considering all the work you’ll have to put into making them. I don’t know if they’ll signify the coming of the next power leap, but they’ve got to at least be competitive with Kaede or what’s the point? To be honest, I’d rather have seen a new MP card series altogether, but I guess this will do.
    • Odin Dragon – Will he finally be relevant?

35 thoughts on “Quick Thoughts on the JP Stream 9/29/16

  1. It’s baffling to me why they didn’t change the awakenings on any of the REM revos. There is already precedent for it in all the other revos in the game and it is so obviously one of the biggest problem with the Greek 1 series.

    Overall I’m a bit disappointed in the power level of the leader skills they’ve shown. It feels like, in a moment of insanity, they broke the game with heart crosses and now want to just pretend that never happened and go back to the power level of PAD before heart crosses.


    • >It feels like, in a moment of insanity, they broke the game with heart crosses and now want to just pretend that never happened and go back to the power level of PAD before heart crosses.
      Pretty much. While I enjoy matching heart-crosses, they’re a bit too OP compared to everything else. I think they’re apprehensive about matching their power level with “normal” multipliers as that could break the game even more (since it wouldn’t have the matching restriction of the cross). We’ll just have to see how much they decide to push things with the MP Dragon uevos.


      • I actually sort of wish they would, for the first time in PAD history, nerf something. The sheer power level of heart crosses seems to be hurting their ability to make interesting new leaders that aren’t just irrelevant in the face of some of the older things. Heart crosses should have never had offensive portions to them and having a heart cross on a leader skill means the damage multiplier should be balanced closer, but still above due to the activation requirement, to tank teams.

        This is coming from someone that owns 4 Kaedes.


        • They’re definitely painting themselves into a corner. The game is definitely less interesting since all the new cards are almost automatically “meh”. And it’s that “meh” that’s making me play less and spend less money on the game. Nerfs would likely benefit the game, but I don’t think anyone would want to deal with the ensuing salt. It’ll be interesting to see how they get out of this, if they ever do.


        • From what I understand, they actually CAN’T nerf REM monsters, due to Japanese gacha laws (not without offering refunds, anyways, and they’ve been out long enough that they would have to refund basically every REM roll for months, since people could just claim that they were rolling for various heart cross leads).


          • People always tend to bring this up, but they never actually have any proof of these “laws”. The only one I know for certain exists is kompu gacha. People also confuse self-regulation with actual law. If this falls under self-regulation and not actual gambling/lottery regulations, then GungHo could technically do whatever they want. However, seeing that the point of self-regulation is to prevent actual, probably more oppressive legislation from being passed, it’s most likely they’d have to act in a manner that wouldn’t attract such attention anyways. So while they would most likely have to give refunds, I wouldn’t actually say it’s law unless there was actual proof of it. If it wasn’t law, GungHo would get to make up whatever amount they felt they can get away with refunding instead of relying on the government to decide (see: Christmas Genie refunds where they waffled on the compensation).

            I’d love for someone to give proof either way, though.

            Also, I know for sure companies can nerf gacha prizes, if that was still up for debate. I’m sure it’s happened in Granblue at least a couple times.


          • In light of the implications for game design of being unable to fix broken game mechanics (leaving aside definitional issues entirely), one would have to be insane to pass a law preventing nerfing gacha rolls, unless as a part of a deliberate indirect assault on the industry’s existence fundamentally.

            Additionally, look at what kompu gacha and related self-regulation is designed to prevent: essentially, induced problem gambling. Preventing nerfing things not only doesn’t address this, it arguably works at cross-purposes, since risk of incoming nerfs makes pouring substantial resources into chasing ridiculously OP things less palatable.

            I get why such a rumor might start, but I just don’t believe any such law could realistically exist without everone knowing about it already (in an amply documented way, moreover). I will believe it when I see it.


  2. Hahaha good luck getting all the Radar Dragons… I find that NA got short-stick’d a little since the Radar Dragons can be obtained through PAD Radar in JP, but we have no alternative other than the brutal Arena 3. And if the point of evolving, say, Ra or Yomi Drag is to have a shot at Arena 3…well…that’s one sorry little catch-22 to be stuck in :^)

    Will RagDrag be getting a super-ult as well, then? I wonder if these MP dragon super-ults will be the first to break the 9-awakening limit. Probably not but that’d be hilarious.

    I find the buffs to the Gala-exclusive cards to be kind of unnecessary…would have rather seen them buff REM pantheon cards… But given that Revos are now a thing for Awoken gods, I guess they’re going to reserve the bulk of the buffs for Revos now. E1 when?

    Still waiting on E2 buffs and Constellation 2 uvos pls.


    • PAD Radar makes JP easy mode in general. Not just Radar Dragons, but the +297 dungeons, Noel Rush, Orpharion parts, Whaledor and crew, free Pys, free +eggs, free mail dungeons, dark Apoc and Izanagi and the other redeemable cards, etc. etc. etc. I’d still like to see NA get the Radar dungeons as one-time dungeons, it’s not like they’re completely trivial to clear so I feel like it should be fine.

      In reality it feels like the awoken revos should’ve been the first to bump the awakening limit, but what do I know? If they were to raise the limit on an MP card, it would likely be with a new MP series to maximize profits.

      Agreed that other cards should’ve gotten buffs before the gala-exclusives.


  3. I also left a full comment on the godfest help thingy, but AYomi and AAnubis got nice buffs too, right? Or were they not part of the stream?


  4. Would assume roguelike rush is more efficient than any of the other methods for sdr, seeing as how the dungeon is actually faster than doing mech hera with equal or less matching required.


  5. As glad as I am that I held on to my spares, the advent of split ults for GFEs has me a little nervous. Like, what’s the remaining incentive for making new pantheons, aside from awokens?

    Yikes at those Revo Awoken xp caps. I think we’ll need another xp value increase for jewel dragons, or something worth a bit more that’s not as infrequent as the Snow Globe Dragons. Also, the Grecos would do well to have a couple TPAs in there somewhere.

    Might as well make Ult RGB golems available as dungeon drops at this point with the amount needed as evo fodder FOR evo fodder. Sheesh.


  6. Funny how they nerfed AA luci who was 4/1/4 and was “op” at the time, yet they don’t change the 4/64/4 kaede (or any of the high multiplier heart crosses), who could really use to tweaks to the downside.


  7. Did you see this.. its like hes playing so casual and yet hes beating arena 1 in like 10 mins while just focusing on small light fire combos lol.. its insane

    might make farming arena even more brainless?

    btw I pulled a parvati.. was sad at first but then realize her Revo looks good, and shes so versatile as a sub haha. not sure how good she is as a lead.. game 8 has her with like Kaede and such but I’m not sure are there any good combos that would make a great heart + green board.. Verdandi + farmable/asteroth is the only one that comes to mind.. maybe skuld inherit + sasuke? seems interesting enough to give it a try I guess!

    I also saw your post in the other thread with Krishna + 4 scarlets. that’s amazing lol, farmable subs that can do arena, atleast I’ll have stuff to play around with aside from heart crosses!


    • Wow, nice vid. Thanks for sharing it! The damage is surprisingly good even before killers. Will I have to eat my words for downplaying both the Grecos and Ilm?

      I really like the new Parvati. I’m not sure she’s worth running over something like Krishna, but I’m pretty happy with her changes. Especially as a sub, like you said. You’re right, there are no great two-color board combinations from base-wood cards which has always been one of her biggest weaknesses. The best might be Sylvie + Michael, but Michael isn’t exactly the best fit. At least is isn’t as big of a deal anymore with the increased multiplier, but it’d still be nice to have some good non-SI options.


    • Angel 2 Lumiel/Famiel did get their true damage buff to be AoE making them alternates to those who don’t have many ras for farming, and Rozuel still sees enough use on teams nowadays. I’ve seen Ariel be used on some Myr teams, and ruel is just meh. They are seeing use, but need something that would actually make you choose them over something else.


      • I think he was just venting about them not getting new ults even though they’re arguably the cards that have needed them the most for the longest time. Listing niche uses or uses on a single team is missing the point and really only serves to support that assertion.


    • Rukia is technically still a card that deserves tier list consideration. As much as I’m loathe to use AppMedia as a source, she’s still on their list and she probably isn’t too far from Game8’s considering what else is there at A. I already went over why I like Shiva and aside from an inferior active he’s vastly superior in every way. Do I think he’ll actually break into the tier lists? Probably not — as I said, it’s really crowded at the top — but I do think he deserves consideration. That’s all I was getting at.


  8. Even if the Greco-Roman still suck, it’s interesting too see where they’re going with this and I can’t wait for the reincarnated Egyptian Pantheon (which is probably the next pantheon for this type of evolution) I’m also courious what they’ll do do the Chinese Girls, as I’m still using AMeimei for a lot of descended (even beat Myr with it)


    • I might’ve misjudged the Greco-Romans a bit as leaders, them being much better for farming applications than I thought (mainly Arena 1). But yeah, in general they are still underwhelming.

      I, too, am looking forward to more revos. Even though they seem really lazy to me and the resource sink really hurts non-IAP players, it’s always good to breathe new life into old cards and have more options. Considering that awoken uevos got more ambitious as they were released, hopefully the same thing happens for future awoken revos.


      • Well, AMinerva basically can’t die on Kali if you play her wisely. You could also pair her with Tsubaki for more damage! But sub wise she’s still a worse Hino, the only advantages she has, is a lower cooldown and not removing heart orbs.
        Neptune and Ceres are still pretty bad, which is kinda disappointing…


    • Pretty much. Let’s hope Radars show up in the new Ultimate Descended Rush 2 whose lineup should be revealed later today after JP maintenance. If we’re even more lucky, they’ll add the PAD X Radar cards like Whaledor et al.

      I guess they could also increase the Radar drop rate from Arena 3, but that doesn’t actually help accessibility very much.


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